Real ID Act.

[Chigun]

Not sure if this has been noted here before. Honestly I do not see any way it could have been missed, so if it has my apologies.

I can't get the link to work (it's dead when you click it from here.) so quickly hop on google and type in "Real ID Act". It should be the second one down 'FAQ: How Real ID will affect you' by CNet. There are of course other things on the subject but that is the best place to start.

In short this is something that that has been passed and will be taking place in May of 2008. This card, which will most likely replace drivers lisences, will not only have all types of information about you for all to see and track (Some including as much as fingerprints and retnal scans) but it will include a computer-readable code identifing who you are. Apparantly you will have to have this card in order to "travel on an airplane, open a bank account, collect Social Security payments, or take advantage of nearly any government service."

You'll have to read what I specified (and more if you wish) in order to get the full details, but this is a serious step twoards security over liberty by good ol' Bush. Some states are fighting back (One has passed something so they will not have to use it.) If you do not use the ID card, you will have to use a passport with a chip inside of it. In other words they can track us even better, possibly every single step we take. Patriot act 2.0 if you will.

Check the validity of this. You will see this was slyly attached on a relief bill and as nearly no one could bring themselves to vote against the passing of this thing. Your thoughts? Also notice how the mass media has yet to say a single word?

- Chigun

[Brains_Behind_Operation]

It sounds like something that is going to eventually make things a lot easier for us, even if it allows the government to track EVERY step we take. Hell, they already have immense records on our credit scores, employment history, and all that other jazz, this just puts it all into one handy little card so it's easier for them and makes many things much easier for us as well.

[Chigun]

Well it gets worse in regards to the government spying on us. Apparantly new RFID chips are soon to be in EVERY single product we buy, allowing who knows whom to track our every possesion and as well make connections to people through their items.

I suppose I'm freaking out because of Bible prophecy, but I won't bring religion into it.

I'm against it, I don't really care how convinient it will be. I like my privacy just fine.

[Brains_Behind_Operation]

Well, do you really have anything to worry about? Is there anything in your life that would hurt you if the government knew about it....assuming that they actually decided it was worth it to invest the time to learn it? If there is something that you don't want anyone to know about you that can be revealed by these new chips, then maybe you should consider changing that something since it's obviously something you're not proud of anyway.

People need to just relax more and realize that noone really cares what they do.

[beelzebub]

Well, do you really have anything to worry about? Is there anything in your life that would hurt you if the government knew about it.....

So I assume you are perfectly fine having the government spying on you? Writing reports on you daily interactions so others may know? And that said you feel totally comfortable having people subjugated to this even though they don’t want it?

I see this as total Big Brother.

[Brains_Behind_Operation]

So I assume you are perfectly fine having the government spying on you? Writing reports on you daily interactions so others may know? And that said you feel totally comfortable having people subjugated to this even though they don’t want it?

I see this as total Big Brother.

I honestly don't have anything to worry about. If the government is that certain that I'm worth spending millions of dollars on just to know what I'm doing every second of my life, then I'm just happy that someone thinks I'm that important. Everyone is far too paranoid and needs to relax about issues that really are completely trivial.

[Zzyzx]

I honestly don't have anything to worry about. If the government is that certain that I'm worth spending millions of dollars on just to know what I'm doing every second of my life, then I'm just happy that someone thinks I'm that important. Everyone is far too paranoid and needs to relax about issues that really are completely trivial.

That "only the guilty have something to fear" idea is going to get us in trouble. We all have the unwritten right to disappear. A nanny government that monitors our every move has been the fear of authors and science fiction writers for centuries.

I don't have anything to hide, but it shouldn't matter if I did! Immigration has always been a problem in this country - miraculously, we've survived! I have no doubt that we'll weather this storm, too.

[Brains_Behind_Operation]

That "only the guilty have something to fear" idea is going to get us in trouble. We all have the unwritten right to disappear. A nanny government that monitors our every move has been the fear of authors and science fiction writers for centuries.

I don't have anything to hide, but it shouldn't matter if I did! Immigration has always been a problem in this country - miraculously, we've survived! I have no doubt that we'll weather this storm, too.

Don't fear change, embrace it and make the best of it. Chances are it's going to make things a lot better than you foresee.

[Chigun]

I found out something (There was an article in Consumer Report, revealing something I had been completely oblivious of) that seems to me to be down the same avenue as the Real ID. Apparently RFID (Radio Frequency ID) chips are soon to be incorporated into every single consumer product you buy. (Even food was mentioned.) Wal-Mart has all ready started selling such products. While these IDs will make shopping and returning slightly easier (like getting our daily bread is SO hard and all. :P) It will allow them to detect what products you buy and where they are. In short another tracking system. Not only this but this technology could leave a whole new world of scamming open. Some of these things are being described as being so smart that it can warn you when your out of a certain product, and so forth.

Am I the only one seriously angry here? I would rather be a damned slave back when honor existed then live in a world where corporations know everything about me, telling me when I need to buy what of theirs and know my every purchase. This isn't mere change, this is yet another ounce of freedom being transmuted into fuel that satiates greed. If you really think this is just for convenience sake, I encourage you to look around and research. We could explain these changes away, but how damn far will it lead with the ruse of being "easier"?

I'm not against all change gentlemen, but I am against this. I see this as a path that leads to the abbility for the most efficient totalitarian government in history. A nation or world where one must have a tracking technology to purchase anything, or else starve. A nation where, should you refuse such technology, would find it impossible to feed yourself. This would be obvious, if any and all products can be tracked. You really think America will remain free should any war tear us apart? Should we depend on the government to pull us out of the next great depression? Should the UN take over us?

Yes I am refering to biblical prophecy in sorts, but even you should see the dangers of allowing both the government and the corporations to have such means over the masses.

Perhaps it's just me, though.

- Chigun.

[Brains_Behind_Operation]

Yes I am refering to biblical prophecy in sorts, but even you should see the dangers of allowing both the government and the corporations to have such means over the masses.

Perhaps it's just me, though.

- Chigun.

I think it's just you. Please try to explain more clearly how these new tracking systems are going bring down the world. How is it really going to make your life worse? Step beyond the paranoia and tell me what damages it will do to you.

[hkdbadreligion]

how about you find the chip and destroy it in the things you buy?

[Brains_Behind_Operation]

how about you find the chip and destroy it in the things you buy?

Wouldn't that be a hoot? You'll have people who spend hours every day digging into the core of their purchases to pry out some worthless speck of gadgetry and smashing it just to stop the capitalists from better understanding their customers. There'll probably be a whole cult of these paranoid hermits, who will end up being easily identified whenever they're in public from their shifty eyes, spindly fingers, and their head crooked down below their shoulders from being bent over in the process of removing the chips for the majority of their day.

[hkdbadreligion]

Do you know me or something? Where've you seen me before?

[Brains_Behind_Operation]

What can I say? You're all the same, and end up having the same physical deformancies from thinking the same things and living the same life.

[sharplee]

what rfid will do is track my every movement. privacy is a right. invasion of privacy is a wrong. yeah, i do have things i don't want the gov to know about, and that is my right.

s

[hkdbadreligion]

You have no rights mother fucker. No one does. We're bred to fight for this stupid mother fuckin country. They apparently arent taking any steps towards population control for a reason.

[Paisleyspeaker]

Rfid and these cards are Big Brother. In Texas they want your thumbprint scanned before they will give you a license. It is already happening Check out Alex Jones at infowars.com for the complete conspiracy thoery. My solution. Buy Vintage. no chips in leisure suits. BBO it may cost millions to check you out now, but the more gadgets and trackers the less it will cost to find out every little thing you do , let them go long enough and they will know what you read in the john, with a puch of a button.
Personally I enjoy my privacy, in thirty years I have managed to not have my prints or DNA recorded anywhere. and I have no reason to give that up now. If my Big Brother doesn't care enough to keep me fed, and housed etc etc then fuck him , he doesn't need to know what I do.:mad:

[Nobody]

Rfid and these cards are Big Brother. In Texas they want your thumbprint scanned before they will give you a license. It is already happening Check out Alex Jones at infowars.com for the complete conspiracy thoery. My solution. Buy Vintage. no chips in leisure suits. BBO it may cost millions to check you out now, but the more gadgets and trackers the less it will cost to find out every little thing you do , let them go long enough and they will know what you read in the john, with a puch of a button.
Personally I enjoy my privacy, in thirty years I have managed to not have my prints or DNA recorded anywhere. and I have no reason to give that up now. If my Big Brother doesn't care enough to keep me fed, and housed etc etc then fuck him , he doesn't need to know what I do.:mad:
You know about Alex Jones, then what do you think of the chip inserts thats being tested, and when the time comes to implant them in the population?

[Paisleyspeaker]

Alex occasionally loses me in the thicket. But I have heard what he said about the chips. they have been putting them in dogs for years. I don't think there will be enough of a fight over the inmplanting. The first few waves will be voluntary. Some beautiful little girl will die in a horrible, brutal fashion, out of the shadows will step a spokesman who says the tragedy didn't have to happen, and if your little ones have one of these fabulous chips you can never loose them. It will be sold like lo-jack for your kids and parents will line up. After a while they will quietly come for us hold outs.

[Nobody]

Alex occasionally loses me in the thicket. But I have heard what he said about the chips. they have been putting them in dogs for years. I don't think there will be enough of a fight over the inmplanting. The first few waves will be voluntary. Some beautiful little girl will die in a horrible, brutal fashion, out of the shadows will step a spokesman who says the tragedy didn't have to happen, and if your little ones have one of these fabulous chips you can never loose them. It will be sold like lo-jack for your kids and parents will line up. After a while they will quietly come for us hold outs.
I believe this is true as well. I hope I'm not here to see it.

[seegs]

Unfortunetly I think you guys are right some poor inocent person will die. That will then be used as the reason to push these things on everyone. "If you have nothing to hide why do you care if they know where you are" What a utter bullshit argument that is. Why doesn't the politicians inject themselves first, and post and interactive website so we could see where are local representatives are. I mean they don't have anything to hide do they?????

[Brains_Behind_Operation]

What do we really have to worry about with these chips? You all say the loss of privacy, but privacy is just an argument for the paranoid. Privacy is an illusion. You have none now, anyone can find out anything about you rather easily. Do any you use credit cards? You do know that every purchase you make with this is recorded on a computer database and the government can go and take this information any time they need to. All that these chips will do is to eventually make that process easier and cheaper. Meaning it will only make our government more efficient. Why is your illusion of privacy so important to you in the first place?

[Paisleyspeaker]

I don't use credit cards, they are a rip off. If you pay only the minumum it takes years to pay them off, and you pay thousands more than you charged. I don't get payed fairly as it is, I don't like wasting money. Whether or not privacy is an illusion the right to privacy is a tangible thing. I should have a right to keep the things that are me/mine secrets. The founding fathers saw fit to include that right in the fourth amendment. Sometimes you can't get things back, so must fight their loss. And it is more than just the government getting this info :D :p :D

Operator: "Thank you for calling Pizza Hut. May I have your national ID number?"

Customer: "Hi, I'd like to place an order."

Operator: "May I have your NIDN first, sir?"

Customer: "My National ID Number, yeah, hold on, eh, it's 6102049998-45-54610."

Operator: "Thank you, Mr. Sheehan. I see you live at 1742 Meadowland Drive, and the phone number's 494-2366. Your office number over at Lincoln Insurance is 745-2302, and your cell number's 266-2566. Which number are you calling from, sir?"

Customer: "Huh? I'm at home. Where d'ya get all this information?"

Operator: "We're wired into the system, sir."

Customer: (Sighs) "Oh, well, I'd like to order a couple of your All-Meat Special pizzas."

Operator: "I don't think that's a good idea, sir."

Customer: "Whaddya mean?"

Operator: "Sir, your medical records indicate that you've got very high blood pressure and extremely high cholesterol. Your National Health Care provider won't allow such an unhealthy choice."

Customer: "Damn. What do you recommend, then?"

Operator: "You might try our low-fat Soybean Pizza. I'm sure you'll like it."

Customer: "What makes you think I'd like something like that?"

Operator: "Well, you checked out 'Gourmet Soybean Recipes' from your local library last week, sir. That's why I made the suggestion."

Customer: "All right, all right . Give me two family-sized ones, then."

Operator: "That should be plenty for you, your wife and your four kids, sir. Your total is $49.99."

Customer: "Lemme give you my credit card number."

Operator: "I'm sorry sir, but I'm afraid you'll have to pay in cash. Your credit card balance is over its limit."

Customer: "I'll run over to the ATM and get some cash before your driver gets here."

Operator: "That won't work either, sir. Your checking account's overdrawn."

Customer: "Never mind. Just send the pizzas. I'll have the cash ready. How long will it take?"

Operator: "We're running a little behind, sir. It'll be about 45 minutes, sir. If you're in a hurry you might want to pick 'em up while you're out getting the cash, but carrying pizzas on a motorcycle can be a little awkward."

Customer: "How the hell do you know I'm riding a bike?"

Operator: "It says here you're in arrears on your car payments, so your car got repo'ed. But your Harley's paid up."

Customer: "@#%/$@&?#!"

Operator: "I'd advise watching your language, sir. You've already got a July 2006 conviction for cussing out a cop."

Customer: (Speechless)

Operator: "Will there be anything else, sir?"

Customer: "Yes, I have a coupon for a free 2 liter of Coke".

Operator: "I'm sorry sir, but our ad's exclusionary clause prevents us from offering free soda to diabetics."

:eek:

[Brains_Behind_Operation]

I don't use credit cards, they are a rip off. If you pay only the minumum it takes years to pay them off, and you pay thousands more than you charged. I don't get payed fairly as it is, I don't like wasting money.


You're only wasting money with a credit card if you're dumb enough not to pay it all off every month that you're able. A credit card offers you money that you wouldn't have yet otherwise. If you have the money, simply use the credit card and pay it off at the end of the month, you won't get charged a DIME! I've been using 3 cards for quite some time now, and have only paid a couple bucks more than my total purchases overall simply because I once forgot to make a payment. The convenience of having credit cards has been well worth it, and I'm sure that if I ever cannot pay off my cards for a while I will still be securely funded by them with the credit ratings that I have built on them.

As far as your little fantasy scenario goes, that's really getting out there. I highly doubt that most companies would do this sort of thing even if they had the tools to pull it off, because it will drive away customers! It would be an optional thing to do, and I don't think that many compaines are willing to bring down their business for it.

[Paisleyspeaker]

As far as your little fantasy scenario goes, that's really getting out there. I highly doubt that most companies would do this sort of thing even if they had the tools to pull it off, because it will drive away customers! It would be an optional thing to do, and I don't think that many compaines are willing to bring down their business for it.


That was a joke, but it is really going to happen. Insurance companies will be the first and the worse. If you have any of a number of genes that link to disease you won't be able to get insurance. Breast cancer gene, sorry it doesn't make any economical sense to insure you. Oh you buy too much beer/candy/pizza you are at risk of alcholoism/diabetes/heart disease we can insure you. Then what if it doesn't make econimical sense to hire you because you may get sick, or may have bad habits they can't live with. There will be many instances when it makes business sense to screw you with your own private information.

[Brains_Behind_Operation]

And you really think that we are going to let that sort of thing happen for very long? It MAY happen a bit in the beginning, but we will quickly see what it is doing to ourselves and start creating specific new laws against those types of discrimination. Just like the laws requiring every company to have X% of their employees have some extra melanin in their skin.

[Nobody]

Unfortunetly I think you guys are right some poor inocent person will die. That will then be used as the reason to push these things on everyone. "If you have nothing to hide why do you care if they know where you are" What a utter bullshit argument that is. Why doesn't the politicians inject themselves first, and post and interactive website so we could see where are local representatives are. I mean they don't have anything to hide do they?????
These poor innocent people have already died! The Oklahoma city bombings, the twin towers, the pentagon, the Pensilvania plane crash. these are the reasoning, the gov. is using to push the chip issue. The bullshit argument, is for some "The Mark of the Beast" If your not familiar with that, then come back later, and let the u.s. people ,hash it out on the poles,before you become a citizen. I wouldn't want to distrust you for what you're going to swear allegense to,( to become a u.s.citizen),before this could happen.

[Nobody]

That was a joke, but it is really going to happen. Insurance companies will be the first and the worse. If you have any of a number of genes that link to disease you won't be able to get insurance. Breast cancer gene, sorry it doesn't make any economical sense to insure you. Oh you buy too much beer/candy/pizza you are at risk of alcholoism/diabetes/heart disease we can insure you. Then what if it doesn't make econimical sense to hire you because you may get sick, or may have bad habits they can't live with. There will be many instances when it makes business sense to screw you with your own private information.
Dogs and cats are already being chipped in large cities. I would guess thats so disgruntelled neghbors who call the animnal scociety for your animal crapping on their lawn, would give the gov. a means to test the water. They would already know where your animal has been. Thats for future use on the general public.

[Nobody]

And you really think that we are going to let that sort of thing happen for very long? It MAY happen a bit in the beginning, but we will quickly see what it is doing to ourselves and start creating specific new laws against those types of discrimination. Just like the laws requiring every company to have X% of their employees have some extra melanin in their skin.
To answer your question, you have to answer this one. Do you know whats in a bill that you'll vote on,that'll become law? < example; It may raise scocial security for the elderly, it'll be for educational purposes, it'll lower taxes.> A lot of people fall for the 'Face bill'. And do you know what is stuffed under the face bill?

[Chigun]

This is why I'm against it:

"16 He required everyone—small and great, rich and poor, free and slave—to be given a mark on the right hand or on the forehead. 17 And no one could buy or sell anything without that mark, which was either the name of the beast or the number representing his name. 18 Wisdom is needed here. Let the one with understanding solve the meaning of the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man. His number is 666."
-Rev.
Enough said.

- Chigun